Eight days later

I don't think I fully appreciated the horror that Hurricane Katrina unleashed upon New Orleans until I read this story yesterday, describing conditions at the Superdome and convention centre.

"Refugees describe piles of faeces, knee-high, after the toilets overflowed and people were forced to relieve themselves on staircases...

At the Superdome there were two reports of rape, one involving a child, while police at the convention centre said there had been similar reported incidents...

Others described what it was like to live among the dead. "We got dead bodies sitting next to us for days. I feel like I am going to die. People are going to kill you for water""

It reminded me of the movie 28 Days Later.

I'm staggered, absolutely floored, that something like this could happen in a major American city, in the wake of a hurricane whose path was known sufficiently far in advance that people had time to evacuate, in locations where it was known that those who remained behind had gone.

What the hell went wrong?

Comments

[Adjustah on 06.09.05 at 14:01]

What went wrong, indeed.

Federal response was absolutely deplorable. Perhaps because most of the people and resources used to combat a situation like this are currently engaged in fighting the war on terror.

There is also a serious comms problem - FEMA is no longer an independent body after 9/11 when it was rereouted to work through the Department of Homeland Security - who can't even find Osama Bin Laden, let alone New Orleans.

A sad, and embarrassing, day for America.

[Raptor on 06.09.05 at 14:23]

It's been a disaster waiting to happen. Bush made it worse. Read this--

Op-Ed Columnist, NY Times
United States of Shame
By MAUREEN DOWD

September 3, 2005

Stuff happens. And when you combine limited government with incompetent government, lethal stuff happens.

America is once more plunged into a snake pit of anarchy, death, looting, raping, marauding thugs, suffering innocents, a shattered infrastructure, a gutted police force, insufficient troop levels and criminally negligent government planning. But this time it's happening in America.

W. drove his budget-cutting Chevy to the levee, and it wasn't dry. Bye, bye, American lives. "I don't think anyone anticipated the breach of the levees," he told Diane Sawyer.

Shirt-sleeves rolled up, W. finally landed in Hell yesterday and chuckled about his wild boozing days in "the great city" of N'Awlins. He was clearly moved. "You know, I'm going to fly out of here in a minute," he said on the runway at the New Orleans International Airport, "but I want you to know that I'm not going to forget what I've seen." Out of the cameras' range, and avoided by W., was a convoy of thousands of sick and dying people, some sprawled on the floor or dumped on baggage carousels at a makeshift M*A*S*H unit inside the terminal.

Why does this self-styled "can do" president always lapse into such lame "who could have known?" excuses.

Who on earth could have known that Osama bin Laden wanted to attack us by flying planes into buildings? Any official who bothered to read the trellis of pre-9/11 intelligence briefs.

Who on earth could have known that an American invasion of Iraq would spawn a brutal insurgency, terrorist recruiting boom and possible civil war? Any official who bothered to read the C.I.A.'s prewar reports.

Who on earth could have known that New Orleans's sinking levees were at risk from a strong hurricane? Anybody who bothered to read the endless warnings over the years about the Big Easy's uneasy fishbowl.

In June 2004, Walter Maestri, emergency management chief for Jefferson Parish, fretted to The Times-Picayune in New Orleans: "It appears that the money has been moved in the president's budget to handle homeland security and the war in Iraq, and I suppose that's the price we pay. Nobody locally is happy that the levees can't be finished, and we are doing everything we can to make the case that this is a security issue for us."

Not only was the money depleted by the Bush folly in Iraq; 30 percent of the National Guard and about half its equipment are in Iraq.

Ron Fournier of The Associated Press reported that the Army Corps of Engineers asked for $105 million for hurricane and flood programs in New Orleans last year. The White House carved it to about $40 million. But President Bush and Congress agreed to a $286.4 billion pork-filled highway bill with 6,000 pet projects, including a $231 million bridge for a small, uninhabited Alaskan island.

Just last year, Federal Emergency Management Agency officials practiced how they would respond to a fake hurricane that caused floods and stranded New Orleans residents. Imagine the feeble FEMA's response to Katrina if they had not prepared.

Michael Brown, the blithering idiot in charge of FEMA - a job he trained for by running something called the International Arabian Horse Association - admitted he didn't know until Thursday that there were 15,000 desperate, dehydrated, hungry, angry, dying victims of Katrina in the New Orleans Convention Center.

Was he sacked instantly? No, our tone-deaf president hailed him in Mobile, Ala., yesterday: "Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job."

It would be one thing if President Bush and his inner circle - Dick Cheney was vacationing in Wyoming; Condi Rice was shoe shopping at Ferragamo's on Fifth Avenue and attended "Spamalot" before bloggers chased her back to Washington; and Andy Card was off in Maine - lacked empathy but could get the job done. But it is a chilling lack of empathy combined with a stunning lack of efficiency that could make this administration implode.

When the president and vice president rashly shook off our allies and our respect for international law to pursue a war built on lies, when they sanctioned torture, they shook the faith of the world in American ideals.

When they were deaf for so long to the horrific misery and cries for help of the victims in New Orleans - most of them poor and black, like those stuck at the back of the evacuation line yesterday while 700 guests and employees of the Hyatt Hotel were bused out first - they shook the faith of all Americans in American ideals. And made us ashamed.

Who are we if we can't take care of our own?

[Big Bad Wolf ^..^ on 06.09.05 at 15:38]

Simple they were not ready at Local State and Federal Level.Lines of communication were not clear..Hell the head of FEMA did'nt even know what was going on at the Convention centre until last Thursday. Out of this mess they will certainly have a better plan...they better hurry up as they might need it this year at the rate Hurricanes are spawning. One thing is for sure they should rebuild at least ten miles inland with a vastly improved building code...Wood Framed houses just cannot stand up to hurricanes.

[ace on 06.09.05 at 16:56]

This was posted on another BBS I frequent. It was posted on September 2nd. It gives a good picture of how crazy it was in New Orleans:

Drove into HELL (New Orleans) last night... Sensitive types stay out
Thought maybe some might enjoy my adventure..

First off I wanted to post what REALLY is going on in this city. Please don't get this thread locked people. The news stations are only showing a minuscule of reality. This post may offend some people but I will post what I saw, like it or not it is REALITY.
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Well last night I was watching the 6pm news when they announced the 17th street canal pumps failed as well as another break in the levee. My house is right off St. Charles Ave. and up to 6pm yesterday is was the only part of the city that was dry. Since the pumps failed and the new break St. Charles Ave. would be under 9ft of water in the next 12-15hrs. My brother and I felt if we wanted to save anything we had to leave NOW. We loaded up flashlights, rope, our medical ID's, both our .45 Glocks, 2 shotguns and rode out. En-route we listened to the radio which broad casted all the news about the looters and what not, in hindsight it was a mistake. My mother didn't want us to go but dad who is a Vietnam vet told to be safe and "shoot to kill" if it ever comes to that.

One the way we had to pass 5-6 checkpoints to allow entry into the city. We stated we were medical personnel who were activated, showed our ID and off we went. On the radio reports were coming in about the officer who was shot in the head, the 2 gunman who opened fired on the NOPD station, and how looters were carjacking cars to get out of the city. This started making my brother nervous and giving second thoughts.

Anyway we get to the city and it looks like a freaking war zone. The best visual I can give is the movie "Blackhawk Down" when all the Somalians are rushing the city. They are people EVERYWHERE, they are pissed off, and all have weapons, 2X4's, Axes, and guns. If this wasn't bad enough we are 2 white boys in a truck in a sea several hundred armed pissed off blacks. There wasn't a white person to be found. I couldn't get over the little 8-10yr old kids with weapons, I ever saw one carry a claw hammer!

These people were absolutely nuts rammed trucks(stolen I'm sure) in to jewelry stores stealing items, they were tearing apart Wal-Mart carrying out TV's, Playstations, DVD players, etc. One lady was wheeling out an entire rack of merchandise, not sure what it was but sure wasn't clothes for food. They were all laughing and carrying on like it's freaking Christmas.

We got stuck in traffic when we see the group of guys walking down the street w/ AK-47's, at that point the "pucker factor" kicked in, a couple Glocks and shotguns were no match for that. We haul *** trying to get to Uptown when we see these people chopping down the front door w/ an axe of this $4-5 million dollar mansion on ST. Charles Ave. I was just in total awe because it was so surreal. Making matters worse it's 11pm at night there is no electricity and you really can't see anything or anyone until they are right up on you.

Our plan was to be in and out in 30min, this included putting his Harley on the trailer. It would have taken me 5-10min tops to get my stuff, all I wanted was my pictures from college, my clothes/shoes, and my computer tower. Well he got scared saying we are going to get jumped while putting the bike on the trailer. Keep in mind this is the only area in the city that is dry. So just like rats who move to higher ground these people were doing the same. Word must have gotten out that Uptown was dry so there started to be a large influx of people.

Needless to say he wanted to go home rather than take our chances. While it was the smart thing to do I was beyond infuriated w/ him because we made it this far. He just kept saying our lives aren't worth it. So we turned around, our next challenge was getting out of the city while not getting jacked. Reports came out that people were jumping in the back of truck holding the drivers at gunpoint. Traffic started to slow so I just nailed it got out as fast as I could.

Even though he was the voice of reason I'm still pissed. All I have is my life and the clothes on my back. I lost my house(which is now 9ft underwater) ALL my clothes, TV, computer, furniture, and photo albums and videos from childhood and college. What makes this worse is my brother owned the house and I was a tenant and I didn't have renters insurance, hindsight is 20/20.

I also hope everyone of the ****ing looters get Tetanus, E-Coli and F*(KING drown. I'm serious I really hope the all die for what they were doing to the city, killing people, and destroying homes. Never in my life have I ever seen people act live savages, it was truly sicking.

Here is the *update* thread I posted today...

Well I attempted fate again and went back to the city. Didn't want to start a flame fest so I figured I'd post afterward. Most of you will not/do not understand WHY I went back but I think some will. This time we went in broad daylight and initially there was to be five but ended up three. We were armed w/ two pistols each(plus 2 back up) and each having 12-gague shot guns (Police/Military spec Remington 870). Once again we were force through 5 checkpoints had to show ID. At the last checkpoint the State Trooper asked "Are you carrying" to which we said yes and he then replied "Good, you may have to use them."

Overall the Westbank of the city is pretty dry, surprisingly. We exited at Tchoupitoulas and it is right near the Superdome w/people everywhere. The road was clear and we didn't stop. First we went to my buddy's house on Magazine which was dry as a bone, no water what so ever. My bro and I set up a perimeter while Lance went inside to get his stuff. Helo's were everywhere, Coast Guard, local oil company, Huey's and even Blackhawks. I'm outside and these two people pass pushing a shopping car and the women is staring at the gun. She said "Damn dat's a big 'ole gun, I just smiled and shook my head "yes". A truck full of National Guards pass by and when they saw us they cheered "Who Hoo" I'm assuming b/c the guns. What was frightening was they they didn't have any guns! We finished there and went on to my house. I was pretty pumped because Lance's house was dry and only a couple blocks down from mmine on the other side of St. Charles. Well my joy shortly faided when every street was covered with water and 200yr old oak branches. We turn the corner and see one of the famous historic New Orleans homes, I mean MANSION to be inhabited by a family who OBVIOUSLY did not live there. I mean this is easily a $5-6 million dollar home and these people are sitting on the porch, kids playing football in the yard, clothes strung out on the lawn. I just couldn't believe it.

The closest I could get to the house without submerging the truck was 5 blocks,great. Water was up to my waist and I'm 5'10. At one point we had o "tightrope walk" across a cemetery wall because the water was so deep it was easily over our heads. As we are walking we are passing families sitting on the porch just watching us, I felt sorry for them. We finally make it to the house and there is about 4ft of water in front which is good because the house is 6ft off the ground. I was happy the house was dry and not looted. We check the house and it's safe and we grab the bare essential, clothes, pictures, documents. I had to leave my new TV, computer, stereo, etc. Well I had about 50lbs in each hand which I soon learned was too much. I'm not weak by any means but carrying 80-100lbs that many blocksabove water was WORK!. Sadly we couldn't get the Harley, but for now it is safe and dry. We gave the family on the porch a couple gallons of water from the truck on the way back.

Next we go to Lance's GF's house and while I'm outside making sure everything is cool a neighbor walks up w/ a sidearm and asked if the Military has arrived yet. I tell him about the troops that rode by earlier and he stated he's shot at several people trying to loot neighbor's houses and cars. He was out of 12 gauge buckshot so I gave him a box.

So we are loaded up and heading toward the bridge when we pass the Wal-Mart on Tchoupitoulas and see two soldiers guarding the store. We pull up to talk to him and I guess he saw the shotguns and he IMMEDIATELY drew his weapon. I'm still not certain what type of fully automatic rifle it was (no M16 or anything like that). Anyway we all put our hands up and ask him if it was safe to exit up ahead and if he needed anything like water, ammo, etc. He said "I'll take all the ammo you can spare". I asked if they are low already and he stated that in anticipation of the storm they sent all the weapons and ammo to Jackson,Ms and it flooded before they could get to them. So THAT is why none of the Guardsmen are carrying. We gave him all the ammo we had minus what was in our clips. So they ended up w/ around 5-6 boxes of buckshot and 150-200 rounds of hollow point .45

He then said 'Be careful up ahead they are rioting at the Superdome. Whatever you do DO NOT STOP. We leave and take the on ramp and infront of us is 200-300 people blocking the on ramp trying to get out of the city. We put out guns to the windows(they have been carjacking every car leaving the city) held the horn and never dropped below 15mph. People were moving away then rushing the truck but after seeing the guns they backed off. I really felt bad for some of those people because they looked tired and have a looong walk ahead of them but we weren't taking any chances

[Big Bad Wolf ^..^ on 06.09.05 at 17:12]

ACE thanks for the insight to Mayhem!!! It is not the Big Easy anymore.

[jake on 06.09.05 at 17:46]

I am happy that this is working out for his family, but those people are not animals. Some are criminals. Others are refugees without the means to leave, and who are trying to stay alive. I know his Harley is more important to him, and I respect his right to defend his property. I also know that the family in the mansion is still alive because they took refuge in a safe place. It is a tragedy on everyone, and I am saddened that more effort was placed on protecting Wal-Mart than providing food and water to those people left at the Superdome for four days.

If you think they are all looters, you are wrong.

[Big Bad Wolf ^..^ on 06.09.05 at 18:14]

No Jake must were not but some where and the tape is there to prove it. The response by American authorities really failed.Those after food and water were entitled to go any where to obtain those bare things for survival.

[ace on 06.09.05 at 18:49]

Jake, I am just the messenger here. I think that this guy was reacting to the open looting he saw. He mentions a few times how sorry he felt for the people and it appeared to my read that it was just the looters he was aiming his nasty comments at.

In no way do I think that the people were all animals or looters but frankly those who participated in the wholesale destruction and theft rampage acted more like animals than humans.

Personally I think the guy was NUTS for going back.

[jake on 06.09.05 at 19:56]

I am sorry Ace. My comments were directed at the writer, not you, and I should have made that more clear.

Apologies.

[Bill Cook on 06.09.05 at 20:10]

I find it illuminating that the US gave at least 200 billion to Israel a state the size of New Jersey as a free gift and it one of the worlds wealthiest per capita incomes.

Apparently putting bridges on those Israeli kids teeth and giving them lap top computers was more important than saving the lives of its own citizenry.

Many of that area served or are serving in the US armed forces

I see a tremendous fall out because of the failure to act sooner and more effectively.

For the moment I think we must wait and see how this tragedy unfolds.

[jbhvt on 06.09.05 at 21:03]

Kanye West had it right, "George Bush doesn't care about Black people", however I would go further and say he, and, more importantly, his ruling (Republican) party and most of America, doesn't care about POOR people, no matter what their color.

As an American, and yes, a Democrat, I am sick about this situation. However, I sincerely hope, especially in light of the fact that Bubba is now going to get to appoint TWO Supreme Court nominees, that all of the people of Louisiana and Mississippi who never bothered to vote, will do so in the next election. Many of the disenfranchised that you see on the news never did--perhaps because they couldn't, but many because they didn't feel their vote was important--and now look at the state of things.

[SmokingGun on 06.09.05 at 21:26]

jbhvt,

I would tend to agree that President Bush has got his priorities a tad screwed up but I also hope Kanye West gets his butt down to New Orleans and shows he's not all mouth.

[Adjustah on 06.09.05 at 21:37]

For those that are interested, here is the video for Kanye West's comments the other night:

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/09/nbc_video.html

I'm with SmokingGun; this guy should pull his finger out and go down to N.O.

I'd have also personally liked it if he'd said something like, "FEMA couldn't find it's own ass with both hands and a map...", but that's just me.

[Big Bad Wolf ^..^ on 06.09.05 at 22:14]

Oprah and all her Angels are down there Kicking some ass...She will get things sorted through the out reach of her show!!! I'm going to dance in the wind when Nate hits just like I did in Fabian. Just gotta watch out for those small tornadoes.I like the force,was in the big surf yesterday...be careful the waves are starting to get marginal on the South Shore don't go in unless you know what you are doing!!!

[Njegos on 06.09.05 at 22:27]

An analogy sprang to mind as I watched Dubya react to the crisis in NO.

Dubya is really America's Deadbeat-Dad-In-Chief. Never around to fix the house, protect his family, or bring home a pay packet, he spends most of his time "investing" his wages in whoring, drinking and picking fights in bars -"Hey Israel, you sure lookin' purdy tonite honey. Hey listen up Iran, I'm gonna whup your ass just like I did to that puny Iraq."

DDIC has his moments of contrition though when he sheds a whiskey-soaked tear for his struggling dependents but reunions are brief as he quickly becomes irritated by the ingratitude of his "loved ones". He kisses them all, waves good-bye and dashes out the door before the subject of his monumental negligence and irresponsibility surfaces; too many bar brawls beckon.

And what about the gangster Cheney, the man who could be president? Which Halliburton no-bid re-inforced bunker is that disgusting troll now hiding in?

[ace on 06.09.05 at 22:39]

Jake, No worries. I can understand fully your reaction...I've been arguing with a bunch of racist fools on the same BBS over many many issues relating to this tragic situation.

My favourite are the morons who claim that the people who were left behind should have walked out of NO, before or after the storm. Of course they have no real answer when I ask them WHERE these people were supposed to walk to or that for the old and very young it would have been impossible.

Or, crap like this:

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/257_1125671727_looting.gif

Let's just say this whole disaster brought out the worst in many many people.

[Big Bad Wolf ^..^ on 06.09.05 at 22:43]

Ace in many more cases it brought out the BEST

[SmokingGun on 06.09.05 at 23:14]

Ironic thing about Katrina is it probably made the Bush family a lot of money. Oil stocks have risen sharply. What's the rush...couple more days...hey Jeb, how bad is it in Florida? OK let's sell and get down to see what's the fuss is all about.

[jbhvt on 07.09.05 at 00:26]

Well it's good to know that the insurance companies (and Bermuda's reinsurance industry) won't be hurting too much from this tragedy: http://www.slate.com/id/2125758/

[Paul on 07.09.05 at 06:16]

I've not got any answers as to what went wrong, but for an up to date account of what is really happening there I strongly recommend that you check out this guy's blog:

http://www.livejournal.com/users/interdictor/

[Steve Moffat on 07.09.05 at 09:17]

A SCOTTISH survivor who was stranded by Hurricane Katrina last night described how she and a group of normally law-abiding citizens became known as the New Orleans Pirates.

Teresa Cherrie said they had to resort to looting from shops to secure food and water.

Waving a make-shift flag from a hotel rooftop, the party of 10 managed to draw attention to themselves and were driven to safety, touching down at Glasgow Airport last night.

Ms Cherrie, 42, and her partner John Drysdale, 41, from Caravelle Way, Renfrew, were caught up in the tragedy after travelling to New Orleans for the second week of a US holiday, after a week in New York.

She said: "The travel company told us it was just a tropical storm, but as soon as we arrived in New Orleans we knew that something was wrong, as there was a mad stampede to get out of the city. We tried to hire a car but there was no way we could, so we made our way to our hotel."

The following day, the couple, who were among a group of 61 guests, were told by the hotel's management that they were being moved to a bigger hotel. After walking four miles, they arrived only to be refused entry.

They walked to a supermarket, but found that the provisions were being looted. "I'm afraid to admit that we joined them," she said.

Ms Cherrie's group, joined by four others, including a man with three dogs, banded together to protect themselves. "We heard shooting and reports of rape, but were told what areas to avoid," she said. "Gangs shouted, 'they've got water', but because of the big dogs they didn't come near us.

"We used a white T-shirt and drew a skull and crossbones on it, and wrote the words 'New Orleans Pirates' as we were a group of law-abiding citizens who had turned to thievery. We laughed about that, but it was the only way we could survive."

Ms Cherrie said that a news agency spotted them and, after seeing film coverage of the group, the British Consul got them out under armed guard.

[Raptor on 07.09.05 at 09:27]

I can't stand Bush's slimy imbecilic evil grins. Here he goes again, as reported by Derrick Z. Jackson, Boston Globe, September 7, 2005:

"Trent Lott is the senator who romanticized himself right out of the Senate majority leadership by praising the late Senator Strom Thurmond's 1948 run for president on a segregationist platform. Lott was one of those people who lost his Gulf Coast home to Katrina. That brought Lott no closer to understanding the human misery in Katrina's wake.

While New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin was pleading in expletives for help from the White House and predicting that thousands of lives would be washed away, Lott had the gall to say, 'I am pleased with the federal government response.'

This was matched by Bush's hop-skip-and-a-jump over the misery last Friday. The White House website features photos of Bush hugging black victims of Katrina. But Bush did not have the time, as presidents and their advance teams often do so artfully, to humanize the disaster by naming a family or unsung individuals for either heroic service or optimism for rebuilding their neighborhoods. The only victim he cited by name in stops in Mobile, New Orleans, and Biloxi was . . . Trent Lott!

'Out of the rubbles of Trent Lott's house -- he's lost his entire house -- there's going to be a fantastic house,' Bush said in Mobile. 'And I'm looking forward to sitting on the porch.' This Bush said to laughter. The only things missing were mint juleps."

[Big Bad Wolf ^..^ on 07.09.05 at 10:19]

And a few southern Belles!

[SmokingGun on 07.09.05 at 10:24]

"I can't stand Bush's slimy imbecilic evil grins."

Raptor, every time I see his moronic grin on TV, I can't help but think that Alfred E. Neuman finally made it to the White House. Drives me nuts too. It's a Mad world we live in.

Seriously though, in this instance I don't care about his politics or agenda, just wish he's act like the freakin President of the USA and push damn hard to help those in need and show some dignity and concern whilst he's doing it. Uuugh.

[boogie on 07.09.05 at 10:48]

And to think he eviscerated Al Gore in 2000 for being part of an administration that spent too much of its time looking overseas and not bothering with domestic US politics.

Note, that on the day after Katrina struck, the opening topic of his press conference was Iraq and the constitution. Then he turned to Katrina.

[Njegos on 07.09.05 at 11:47]

Irony abounds:

1) Small government dogmatists defending the performance of a hapless federal agency.

2) Rescue helicopters grounded for "security reasons" during a Dubya press conference.

3) Thousands of Louisiana and Mississippi National Guard stuck in the sweltering heat of Iraq watching their home towns drown on TV.

4) A God who instructs Dubya to strike at al-Qaeda and Saddam Hussein but who is curiously silent about Katrina.

5) US govt. funding slashed for levee maintenance and improvement but increased for Israeli security.

6) And of course, the ultimate humiliation - emergency assistance offered by, inter alia, FRANCE!!

Dubya + Power = Catastrophe

[USA on 07.09.05 at 12:42]

Limey-
First of all I would like to ask why you are starting a thread concerning American politics. I clearly asked you a month ago why nothing was brought up about the blunder in the UK when the police shot and murdered an unarmed supposed terrorist in the tube because I thought it might be the source of some discussion. I continued by saying it sounds like the Limeys don't like talking about their screwups, they just like poking fun at the US. Your response was quote "I only like to post topics of discussion that are of importance to Bermuda and its politics that are current issues." Therefore what the HELL does this topic have to do with Bermuda or its politics.
For everyone else on this thread so far - would you all like some wine with that cheese. I am a white US male and I have a few things to tell you.
1. There are plenty of people that could not leave for whatever reason BUT there were plenty of people who could of and who didn't. You know why? Because they are either stupid morons who refused a MANDATORY EVACUATION or who thought how great it would be to steal as much shit as possible once everyone left.
2. To all those looters, rapers and thieves down there I hope they all get shot and dumped with all the other garbage in that shithole.
3. Do you all know why white people look at black people in the US with such a stigma is because all you have to do is watch what is going on. They didn't loot Walmart for food ...they went in and stole as many guns as they could. What a great idea!!!
4. After watching the relief efforts, how many rescue people and volunteers are black and how many are white? Prodominantly all White.
5. This is something that we will never find out, but I wonder how much money is donated from the black community versus the white community?
Bermuda has been through a catastophic hurricane and just because we are the US you think that everything should be peachy keen. No amount of money or preparedness could change what has happened in N.O. It is absolutely idiocy to think otherwise but then I guess you all need to get your fill of poking fun at the US and its Pres. because if you didn't you might have to starting taking a look at your own politics or fuck ups and then where would you be on this site. Oh Yeah... you would be talking about current events in Bda which is what are supposed to be doing anyway! Piss Off!

[Njegos on 07.09.05 at 12:59]

I think Dubya just visited the forum.

[SANDGROWNAN on 07.09.05 at 13:01]

Hey USA..bet it really pisses you off that France, Venezuala and Cuba have offered help.

[USA on 07.09.05 at 13:06]

Sandgrownan,
I hope we don't accept the offer from those two faced beotches!

[SANDGROWNAN on 07.09.05 at 13:09]

...or the offer of oil from Iran? An axis of evil member...

So, I hear Pat Robertson wants to assasinate the leader of Venezuela. Not very Christian is it?

[Chris Broadhurst on 07.09.05 at 13:10]

"No amount of money or preparedness could change what has happened in N.O".

....other than not building an entire city below sea level, and when the obvious happened, pledge to rebuild it AGAIN.

[Phil on 07.09.05 at 13:14]

USA

The focus of this site is indeed what's going on in Bermuda. But as I'm sure you're well aware, I do touch on international topics that interest me too. In case you hadn't noticed, hurricane Katrina is a major international news story.

If you wish to comment on the shooting in London, please feel free to do it on my post about the London bombings here.

Now, onto the topic at hand.

You say the people who didn't evacuate were either "stupid morons" or would-be looters. Has it not occurred to you that there were also people who did not have the means to leave the city, or had nowhere to go?

As for your comments about blacks, perhaps you should also ask youself why some blacks in the US view whites with such a stigma. Answer: comments like yours.

[Njegos on 07.09.05 at 13:23]

Ouch USA! Your face is burning red.

"1. There are plenty of people that could not leave for whatever reason BUT there were plenty of people who could of and who didn't. You know why? Because they are either stupid morons who refused a MANDATORY EVACUATION or who thought how great it would be to steal as much shit as possible once everyone left."

Or because they wanted to protect their property?

"2. To all those looters, rapers and thieves down there I hope they all get shot and dumped with all the other garbage in that shithole."

That's what Dubya wants too. In fact, he would like us to believe that NO is nothing BUT looters rapers and thieves so we might all think that NO deserved Katrina. Gets him off the hook nicely.

"3. Do you all know why white people look at black people in the US with such a stigma is because all you have to do is watch what is going on. They didn't loot Walmart for food ...they went in and stole as many guns as they could. What a great idea!!!"

Or because they wanted to protect their property?

"Bermuda has been through a catastophic hurricane and just because we are the US you think that everything should be peachy keen."

But it doesn't stop you from lecturing others, does it?

"No amount of money or preparedness could change what has happened in N.O. It is absolutely idiocy to think otherwise"

Right. So let's keep pouring that money into Iraq instead of re-inforcing NO's levees. Let's keep developing the natural wetland barriers. Who cares because it was going to happen anyway.

"I continued by saying it sounds like the Limeys don't like talking about their screwups, they just like poking fun at the US."

Our biggest screw-up was following you into Iraq.

[USA on 07.09.05 at 13:30]

Limey,
1. I know that you like to touch on international news, but we never see you touching on news that happens in say S. America, Italy, Germany or even South Afirca for that matter. Surely these countries have interesting debates about current issues. I think that it is safe to say that mostly you like to touch on news concerning the US and put a negative spin on the outcome because it is so popular to mock the US.
2. It has occurred to me that some people may have not had the means to leave or had nowhere else to go but were there not buses and even trains used for evacuation before the storm hit? And although I have a car don't you think if I did not that I would have searched for higher ground or made SOME attempt to leave, even if I had to walk. I have said that I know it was impossible for everyone toleave, but look at all the perfectly healthy looters and thieves who COULD have left and did not.
3. I already know why blacks view whites with such a stigma in the US.....if YOUR site is any indication it must be because I haven't apologized for slavery. Don't hold your breath for that one.

[USA on 07.09.05 at 13:38]

Njegos,

But FOLLOW you did.

[SANDGROWNAN on 07.09.05 at 13:41]

Ah USA...but as flag waving morons you all supported Dubya, whereas the British public did not support Blair. He did it anyway. And it will cost Labour the election.

[ace on 07.09.05 at 13:42]

"1. There are plenty of people that could not leave for whatever reason BUT there were plenty of people who could of and who didn't. You know why? Because they are either stupid morons who refused a MANDATORY EVACUATION or who thought how great it would be to steal as much shit as possible once everyone left."

Wow...this is like deja vu from the other site I frequent.

Mr. USA...here is a little story:

A number of years ago I was in Paris for Bastille Day. My girlfriend (at the time)and I were at the Eiffel Tower at around midnight busy dodging fireworks that were being hurled at anyone and everyone.

After a while we had had enough so we decided to head back to our hotel, which was in the Latin Quarter.

As we approached the subway stop we were greeted by a worker who was busy locking the place up. No problem, say I, we'll just grab a cab.

Now, if you know anything about Paris you will have to stop reading and have a good giggle...because there were NO TAXIS. (Well, none that would stop anyway).

We became a couple in a sea of tourists all wondering how in the heck we were supposed to get back to our hotels. A number of ladies we passed were in tears because they had no idea how...or even where they were.

I was pretty pissed off, but quickly realised that there was nothing we could do....we had to walk back.

We arrived back at our hotel just before 6.00am.

Bear in mind....there was no flood waters to deal with, no gangs of looters, no children to carry, no elderly to look after. It still took over 5 and a half hours to walk about half-way across a pretty large city.

But....here you are suggesting that people in New Orleans could have easily gotten out and that the only reason they stayed was becuase they were morons or to loot????????

Where were they going to go even if they were able to get out? Who was going to help them with the children and/or elderly? What were they going to eat on this trek they were supposed to embark upon? A trek that would take many many hours to complete...to nowhere in particular.

Hmmm?

[USA on 07.09.05 at 13:51]

Ace,
I have already stated that I know that evryone could not have gotten out but what about the ones that could of, that did not? Don't you think that the criminally minded would know that after the evacuation the city would be there for the taking especially with a lack of police forces? If not then you are truly naive my man.
Also let me weigh the decision....stay home and almost certainly drown or die of starvation,dehydration,rape,gunfire etc..OR make an effort of some sort and hope for the best. Not much of a decision for me.

[Phil on 07.09.05 at 13:52]

USA

This is a blog. As I'm sure you're aware, bloggers talk about topics that interest them. I have no obligation to cover or avoid any topic. If you're interested in what's going on in Germany, go read a German blog.

If I tend to be critical of Dubya it's not because it's popular to be that way, but because I do actually think he's a retard. I criticise the response to hurricane Katrina not because it's popular to do so, but because I think someone cocked up (whether that was more FEMA or Bush is still an open question). If you don't like that, too bad. You can either explain why you disagree or just stop reading. It's up to you.

[Chris Broadhurst on 07.09.05 at 14:01]

"If I tend to be critical of Dubya it's not because it's popular to be that way, but because I do actually think he's a retard".

.....I couldn't believe they voted him in once - but twice, that just shows how stupid the average American really is.

[Njegos on 07.09.05 at 14:09]

"Njegos,

But FOLLOW you did."

Wow. This is an interesting revelation. USA clearly has more respect for countries like France who didn't march off the cliff with Dubya cliff into Baghdad Canyon.

"Not much of a decision for me."

Precisely USA. Everyone should be like you, think like you. Thank you.

[hotspur on 07.09.05 at 14:10]

USA, I've clearly been brainwashed by all this finger pointing. So please, give me 5, no I'll make it easy, 3 things that Bush did during the aftermath of Katrina that demonstrated good leadership.

Let’s face it, you’re a minority voice at the moment so here’s your chance to swing some opinion.

[jake on 07.09.05 at 14:12]

"I already know why blacks view whites with such a stigma in the US.....if YOUR site is any indication it must be because I haven't apologized for slavery. Don't hold your breath for that one."

Hey USA, I am black and I don't need an apology for slavery.

I would like to weigh in here, because I have also seen the images of masses of black people in N.O. both as refugees and as looters.

It is one of the sad aspects of real life that the majority of poor people in N.O. are black and that many of the crimes perpetuated were by black people. No excuses for them or their behaviour.

It is also the reality that the majority of people needed help, and got none, and they committed no crime at all. None. They share a racial description with the criminals but are no more to blame than you or I. At all.

Overwhelming support came from all over the country (I am in the US right now) and much of that (the majority even) came from white people. That should not surprise you. Americans are generous and most Americans in the middle and upper classes are white. That is not a criticism, nor intended to take away from good people doing good work, but it is based on the people, not their race.

I too tire of the the holier than thou attitude displayed by many against the USA and President Bush as if they were the same thing. Obviously they are not, but the sentiments get confusesd often.

It is a very sad tragedy in N.O. and many people, black and white are helping. The blame game, as it has been described, is not part of that effort.

[USA on 07.09.05 at 14:17]

Limey,
Geez don't get so defensive! I know this is a blog and bloggers will speak about subjects that interest them and you have every right to do so, but don't get so exasperated when someone like myself brings up a valid point. All you had to say was that this is my site and I will post anything that I damn well please....I think I would have preferred that.
Maybe a post by anyone who is Pro USA and who happens to show a chink in your armor is not welcome:)

[jake on 07.09.05 at 14:18]

This really is not about President Bush and his response.

He was the one who sent the Lt. Col. Honore in, who took charge and got things happening. The shame has been the response by the Governor who has failed her State with pandering over who should be in control.

The President does have to take responsibility for the failure in leadership of FEMA, and in time that will happen, but there is little that he could do without the support from the local authorities.

The war in Iraq has nothing to do with the capability to deal with the events in N.O.

If you think that it does, you have little scope for the true size and power of the USA.

Right now private companies are leading the way with support and national organizations are getting it done.

[ace on 07.09.05 at 14:23]

"I have already stated that I know that evryone could not have gotten out but what about the ones that could of, that did not?"

Does this include people who "could" have gotten out but decided to stay to care for children and their elderly relatives? Does it include people who decided to stay because they were terrified of being removed from their home and away from friends and relatives to...well, who knows?

I have no doubt that some of the gang members and drug addicts stayed with the expressed intention of looting whatever they could find. Do YOU think these numbered in the tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands? If not then they must have had some "other" reason for staying put, right?

"Also let me weigh the decision....stay home and almost certainly drown or die of starvation,dehydration,rape,gunfire etc..OR make an effort of some sort and hope for the best. "

You sir are making that decision with the benefit of 20/20 HINDSIGHT. Sure there were those who realised that the approaching storm COULD have been as devastating as it was, but many did not know or appreciate what was coming their way....especially the poor. I doubt very many of them expected the absolute lack of any assistance for days on end, or that there would be armed gangs raping and pillaging.

Stop and think for a moment...who was it that was being robbed and raped (not looted). It was those dummies who stayed according to you. No sympathy? Not an ounce of pity for those who stayed? Is that the "American Way"?

[Git on 07.09.05 at 14:28]

Um, um. Hey uncle sam... nice to have you.

A few pints if I may:

We are vulnerable to major hurricane damage.

We have racial issues/tensions here.

Our emergency measures personnel/systems are expected to perform at a high level in times of crisis.

Can you see past your rabid hyper-sensitivity and recognize that there are some compelling parallels here?

On the other foot:

We don't have cops shooting the wrong suspects. (heck, our police don't even carry guns during regular duties.)

We have also not (knock wood) had any issues with terrorists or sympathizers to date.

On this issue, no one in the world is bashing your goverment more than your fellow citizens right now.

Local issues get PLENTY of airtime on this site.

I would tell you to piss off, but that would be ruder than not saying, 'good morning' at TCD now would't it?

[SmokingGun on 07.09.05 at 14:31]

USA is right, in fact I saw it with my own eyes. There he was this 93 year black dude in his wheelchair just plowing through the streets. Gun toting dude was raping and theiving and looting. He'd have got all the way to the Superdome if is air hadn't run out.

[observor on 07.09.05 at 14:32]

jake

You are absolutely correct.

Unfortunately the democrats and other liberal organizations are seizing upon the blame game as an opportunity to make political hay by trying to sway support from the borderline red states by directing unproductive attention towards the office of the president.

Instead these people should be focusing their energy on providing assistance to the people of the gulf coast who have lost so much rather than trying to score selfish political points that do nothing more than further cloud the already murky waters surrounding NOLA.